Episode 50: Celebrating Episode 50 and 2022 Year in Review!

Lisa Peña (LP): It's a special day as we celebrate our milestone 50th episode! Join me and our guest co-host as we talk about the highlights and sometimes challenges of producing 50 conversations. Plus, we're revisiting the fascinating technology today topics of 2022. It's a packed discussion next on this 50th episode of Technology Today.

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We live with technology, science, engineering, and the results of innovative research every day. Now, let's understand it better. You're listening to the Technology Today podcast, presented by Southwest Research Institute. Transcript and photos for this episode and all episodes are available at podcast.swri.org.

Hello and welcome to Technology Today. I’m Lisa Peña. Today, we are saying farewell to 2022 with a recap of the intriguing, innovative, and inspiring topics over this past year. And we're also marking our 50th episode of the Technology Today podcast with a special guest co-host, our very own audio engineer, Bryan Ortiz. He's with us in front of the mic for the very first time. Welcome, Bryan.

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Host Lisa Peña and Audio Engineer Bryan Ortiz, who is co-hosting for the first time, celebrate reaching the milestone 50th episode.

Bryan Ortiz (BO): Hello! Glad to be here in front of the mic this time, like you said.

LP: Yeah, we're excited to have you here. Bryan is usually behind the scenes, monitoring our sound, and checking levels, but today he's co-hosting, and we will be chatting about our experiences over four years and 50 episodes. So Bryan, we have really come a long way.

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And definitely a lot to cheer about. So Bryan, as audio engineer, what are your goals during a podcast recording?

BO: The main goal for me during a podcast recording is to make sure that everything is going smoothly, and that the sound is clear. That's always the good job of an engineer. You do a great job at building the show and making sure everyone's talking and getting the answers out, so I want to make sure that everyone can actually hear it. And I want to make sure that it's clean as possible in whatever situation you're in, and that's really important at the end of the day. We want to make sure it's a good, well-produced show on both the question and interview side, as well as the engineering and audio side.

LP: Well, we've appreciated your attention to detail over 50 episodes now. I think to turn that question around on myself, I think my goals are always to break down these sometimes complicated topics. Not all of us have that science or engineering background. And I think it's important for our listeners to really grasp the information on a level that I think anyone can understand.

So I always appreciate that our guests are able to get through their Tech Talk, or those really technical terms they're so used to using, and make it understandable for all of us. And I think that's one of my goals. I think my other goal is to get to know the people behind the science, and I hope that comes across in every episode. I think it's important to get to know these scientists and engineers that are changing our world, right here at SwRI.

We have so much going on here, and it's so nice to have this outlet, this platform. I think at one time, SwRI was known as the city's best kept secret. So we're here in San Antonio, Texas, and I think at one time had a reputation for being the city's best kept secret. Well, we're not a secret anymore, and I hope the podcast has contributed to people understanding some of the important work that we do here on a daily basis. So I think those are my goals.

BO: You have done 50 episodes now, and you've talked to a lot of guests, like you said. A lot of science and technology, and helped get the name out og SwRI. Let's just ask the big question that I think most people want to know. What is your most memorable episode that you've done? You've done 50 of these at this point. So many conversations, so much technology. Do you have a favorite?

LP: Well, so I wouldn't call it a favorite. I mean, there are many. I can go through the catalog of 50, and I can think about something special about each one. And all of our guests have been fantastic. But there is one that has really stayed with me, I guess you could say that. So I call it, I would say it is maybe my most memorable, and that would have to be one we did last year for Earth Day, April 2021. It's episode 30, recycling plastic for fuel. Our guest was SwRI chemical engineer, Eloy Flores. And he talked to us about turning piles of plastic waste into useful chemicals and fuels.

50 episodes and counting!

BO: I remember that.

LP: It's about a method of recycling that gets plastics out of the landfills, gets plastics out of the ocean. And I think that's what really stuck with me, was he told us about this part of the Pacific Ocean called the Great Pacific Garbage Patch.

BO: Right, yes.

LP: Yeah, and so you can't forget something like that. I didn't really know about it before this episode. It's actually really sad situation out in the Pacific Ocean. There's just piles of plastic waste. So it really makes you think about what you do in your day to day life, and how you can keep plastic waste out of our precious waters.

So I think that episode really stuck with me. It really had an impact. And then I think if I had to name another one, I can't forget the first one. That was with Dr. Alan Stern, and he is the principal investigator of the New Horizons mission. And so it was just before they were going out to fly by what was then called Ultima Thule, now renamed Arrokoth.

Arrokoth is this object out in the Kuiper Belt. It was the furthest distance that the mission had ever flown. So they were prepping for this big event to fly by, and take pictures, and see Arrokoth for the first time. So that was really neat getting his perspective, and feeling his excitement, and listening to him prior to that big flyby.

And so that was also a memorable episode because we, it was the first one, first of all, and then we didn't set up in the studio. We had to meet him at a conference. So they had a designated area for us at this hotel, and we were able to set up. And we had a really interesting conversation with him during one of his conference breaks. So definitely memorable for me. How about you? Does anything come to mind for a most memorable podcast episode?

BO: Also, the first one as well for somewhat of a different reason. I also thought it was very fascinating, crazy that our first episode was a remote episode right away. And we were still all learning and figuring out and building. But for me, what's so funny is I've done so many of these with you, but the very first one, I was not there.

LP: Yeah, you weren't there.

BO: That drives me absolutely bananas. That drives me crazy because I really wanted to be there for it, but I remember something was going on, whether I was involved in a production, or I was doing something. But I couldn't be there, and all I could see was I was getting these photos, and I was seeing the things from a distance. And I was so jealous because oh, it's the first one, I want to be there for it!

LP: Well, Alan Stern was an amazing guest, and Ian McKinney, our other audio engineer, Ian McKinney jumped in and set us up for that at the designated spot at that conference. So it went well. It was an exciting way to launch this podcast back in November 2018.

BO: It was a learning experience also. Because then when I heard back and I started to edit it, I started to notice things, hear things, so it was the first time really experiencing that. So that was very interesting for me to be able to do that.

LP: Yeah. I think it's important to note that this podcast, I think, was a first for the entire podcasting team. None of us had really done a podcast before. While I have broadcasting background, while I have news background, and you also have tons of technical background, we've never done a podcast. So we just brought in our different expertise, and launched this in the best way we knew how, and here we are, 50 episodes later, so.

BO: Up until that point, all I was able to do was be on podcast as a guest with other people and do little talks. But I never dove into the absolute technical aspect. Even though I understand the materials, I understand that technology, putting it into practice and applying it to our job, that was different. And that was very cool because it offered me the ability to have a new skill set that I didn't have before. Everything that I had seen from the microphone, I'm now experiencing from behind the microphone. And I really enjoyed that.

So starting that journey was funny to me because I wasn't there to start the journey. I didn't start until later, but I got to it. And I'll never forget that after 50, I'm like, I just wish I was there for the first one.

LP: Well, you have certainly more than made up for it.

BO: Oh, good. There we go.

LP: So you were talking about learning a new skill set. So podcasting during the height of the pandemic brought us some really interesting changes. We had to find a new way of doing things, and new places to record. So a lot of industries, a lot of people had to do things differently in March of 2020, so we were no different. So let's talk about that for us. If you'll give our listeners a little bit of insight about what the pandemic looked like for us.

BO: It was very interesting because we had just really started to get into a flow. We had started to figure things out for ourselves, and what we wanted to do. We were getting comfortable in our space, and then this, a huge global event happened. And it completely changed for us, especially in our work, as I'm sure it did for many other people out there listening. It was a very difficult time. But we had to keep producing shows, but the ability to not be in person anymore was all of a sudden taken off the table.

So we all worked it together from in front of the mic, behind the mic, everyone talking and discussing and seeing what options. And it really started off as a big trial and error situation for us. Because we had not ventured yet into having the ability to have people call in yet. We were still getting started, so we hadn't moved to that area, but we had to quickly learn all together by either purchasing new equipment, or discussing how we wanted to talk to the people.

And for me, the biggest takeaway was that I had the opportunity to learn how to do podcasting over the internet. Over Zoom, over Webex, over whatever brand of streaming service that we used. That was interesting to me because I purchased equipment, I set up my own home studio, which I still have today, and I was able to learn what I needed to from the comfort and safety of my house, and then apply that to our job. And I thought that was cool. Because that wasn't even in the cards in the beginning.

And here I am now with my own stuff, my own equipment, learning how to do something cool that I really loved, and have grown to love exponentially. And have been able to create more shows, and more products because I learned that skill set. So silver lining taken away something positive at least from something negative, as I learned something new, and I was able to apply it to us.

And that was cool because we've got to watch you learn how to have conversations over Zoom, the technical aspects of getting clean audio as clear audio as possible. Dealing with various different microphones, different sound systems from people, which was always difficult. But adapting as best we could to each one of them. And so I really appreciated the challenge that we got from each one of those, and I appreciated the new skills and new toys that I got to have in my home. So that was always fun.

LP: Yeah, so you did a great job being flexible and figuring out, OK, what's next, what do we need. So just to let our listeners know about our journey. So we started in the studio, face to face with our guests. Great equipment. So then March 2020 hits, and we are thinking, OK, what do we do now? We haven't really explored Zoom at this point as much. So our first thought was phone calls. So we did. We did a couple of episodes over the phone.

BO: We did, that's right.

LP: And they sounded as great as phone call recordings can sound.

BO: As good as a phone can sound, that's what we got.

LP: So we went from that to, then we went over the streaming sites, and the audio quality was much better there. But then you're dealing with internet issues at times. So it's been fun. And one thing I want to add is that as you said, it's given you some, you had to take all of the equipment home. For me, I was looking for good audio quality at home. So that first episode we did over the phone in March 2020, I actually recorded from my bedroom closet.

BO: Oh.

LP: Yeah, so I had heard that when you're on the go and you're podcasting that clothes make great insulation.

BO: Absolutely. 100% do.

LP: So I tested it out and it worked. So since then, I've learned how to build in insulation pillow fort type setup. So it's definitely pushed our boundaries of creativity. So I think it's interesting that, so here we are back in our studio. This is actually our first episode back in our studio face to face.

BO: How appropriate on 50.

LP: Yeah, so it's nice to be back here. And we are looking forward to a new podcasting space in the new year, so we will be back face to face more often right in our new podcasting space.

BO: Can't wait. Very excited for a new building, just to have, for us to have a good old time in.

LP: Yeah, more for the next 50 and beyond.

BO: Yes.

LP: OK Bryan, well, it is great to have you on this side of the mic today as we review the exciting topics of 2022. So we're going to get back to our podcast chit chat in a bit. But we're going to take you through the year now. Some of our exciting topics of the year include the possibilities of hydrogen as an energy source, a conversation with a planetary science pioneer, and learning about the life and accomplishments of SwRI founder, Tom Slick. So let's get to it. Bryan Ortiz as our co-host today. Bryan, go ahead and kick things off. What were we talking about back in January?

Bryan Ortiz: I'm excited to recap 2022, so let's get started. We flew into 2022 with unmanned aerial vehicles, or drones. SwRI is taking drones beyond everyday uses, like photography and surveillance, and outfitting them with special software, expanding UAV applications. SwRI engineer and manager Dr. Eric Thorn told us about the Institute's advanced drone technology.

Lisa Peña: What takes our technology to the next level? How is your team enabling drones to do more than your average UAV?

Dr. Eric Thorn: Sure. So a lot of the things I've talked about so far still have a person in the loop. They're either monitoring the drone, or directly controlling the drone as they're trying to execute this mission or this application. Where we fit in, what we've been working on is adding intelligence and adding autonomy to not necessarily take the person out of the loop, but maybe reduce the cognitive load on that person, so that they can multitask while the drone is executing a mission or executing some type of application.So for instance, something we've been developing is an exploration capability. So basically, a remote pilot can initiate this exploration capability, and the drone can then fly around largely unknown area, and map out that area without the person having to tell it specifically where to go. It figures out on its own where it should fly to maximize how much it's seeing of the world.

Lisa Peña: In February, we told you about SwRI's fire testing services. The tests are carried out in burn labs where our experts evaluate how a range of materials, products, and systems hold up to flames. SwRI director of fire technology, Dr. Matthew Blais spoke about turning up the heat for safety. So that's a scary thought, yeah. So we all have these huge items in our house that, if not properly tested, could be a hazard. And so that's what your team is there for looking at these items, and letting us know more about their safety. So with each test, what are you trying to learn? What type of information are you gathering?

Dr. Matthew Blais: The first thing is how hard is something to ignite? How much energy does it require to get it to burn? And then if it does burn, because a lot of things don't, how much energy does it release over time, and how hazardous that will be in a home or an industrial setting. We look at everything from baby carriage to car seats to entire vehicles, gas tanks, wall construction, anything you can think of that might be a hazard in fire, we look at. We even look at sprinkler systems and their ability to put out fires. Whether or not it's big enough and powerful enough to stop a larger fire. We do just about everything you can think of related to fire, and not just to US standards, but to the international standards as well.

Bryan Ortiz: For Women's History month in March, we highlighted the revolutionary work of SwRI space science pioneer, Dr. Robin Canup. Canup is known for her trailblazing research of the Earth-moon system. She is also a trained and accomplished ballerina. In this episode, she spoke about the parallels between ballet and science.

Lisa Peña: So that's just really amazing to have done both at the same time, and just the parallels between the two. Yeah, so as you explain that, it's really obvious. So do you feel like your work as a ballerina, was there times that pushed you further in your space science endeavors?

Dr. Robin Canup: Absolutely. In fact, I would say that a lot of my training in ballet, both as a child and then in my 20s, it really taught me both how to learn, how to constantly work to improve yourself, and how to not give up. How to persist, even when things seem like they're perhaps too challenging for you. And so for me, I would say a lot of my internal approaches to learning and improving came from ballet, and I still use those. And in my scientific work.

Lisa Peña: For our Earth Day episode in April, we explored the possibilities of hydrogen gas, a cleaner energy source. SwRI mechanical engineer, Angel Wileman, who leads the Institute's hydrogen collaboration initiative discussed what hydrogen technology could mean for the environment.

Angel Wileman (AW): So we're going to have to find a way to get carbon out of the atmosphere, as well as stop producing it. That's kind of like a two-pronged approach. That's going to take a while.

Lisa Peña: So when you think of the possibilities of hydrogen, how do you feel, are you optimistic?

AW: Yes, I am very optimistic. And part of it is because I have confidence in the researchers here at SwRI. I have confidence in the researchers across the US at coming up with some of those technology advancements that we mentioned, and I think that hydrogen has a real place in our transition away from fossil fuels. I don't think it's going to be the one final solution, but I am optimistic that we are going to come up with some amazing technologies very soon, and it's going to be cheaper and easier to use renewables, and make hydrogen in the future than it is right now.

Bryan Ortiz: In May, we learned about methods used to detect leaks in oil and gas pipelines. SwRI engineer Shane Siebenaler, director in our fluids engineering department, explained how our experts use cutting edge technology to find weak spots and damage to pipeline systems before they pose a danger to people and the environment.

Lisa Peña: All right so we have exciting things happening at SwRI, a lot going on to detect these leaks. How are we advancing state of the art technology to detect leaks onshore and offshore?

Shane Siebenaler: So we both developed technology and help other companies in their technology development. And this is everything from lab scale, doing control tests, all the way out to implementation in the field. And so we need these systems, for example, to be able to work in the summer in south Texas, and the winter in North Dakota. And one element in recent years that the Southwest Research Institute has particularly been involved in is adding artificial intelligence, and more specifically, machine learning. So I mentioned earlier that you have a human in the loop to make a judgment as far as whether or not an alarm is real. So imagine a system with a lot of data coming in. You don't want to have somebody who has to stare at the screen all day, and make real-time judgments of trends. So we are able to add a layer for a lot of autonomy to be done by the computer, and that allows for better decision making in a more concise manner for the operator.

Lisa Peña: We had our first guests from SwRI's wholly-owned subsidiary, Signature Science LLC in Austin on the podcast in June. President and CEO, Brian Schimmoller, and data scientist, Dr. Molly Isbell, told us about the COVID-19 exposure assessment tool. C-E-A-T or CEAT. CEAT can tell you if a meeting, event, or family gathering will put you at risk for contracting COVID19. But today we're talking about a Signature Science project, the COVID19 exposure assessment tool, C-E- A-T. What is CEAT? How do you describe it?

Dr. Molly Isbell: So CEAT is an interactive tool that allows users to enter information about a scenario. Typically, it's when you're going to have people gathering together. It was really developed initially for use with Signature Sciences. We were thinking about bringing people back into the workplace. So it allows users to enter information about the number of people that might be in a gathering, information about the venue, is it outside, is it inside, what's the size of the room, what's the ventilation of the room, how far apart of people are going to be, how long is the event. And it takes all of that information and synthesizes it together to come up with an estimate of the exposure risk associated with that event. That's the short answer about what CEAT is.

Brian Schimmoller: I'll add in that, so when we were first started to think about SEAT and work on SEAT, it came from wanting to ourselves, understand the risks that our own employees would have coming back into the workplace.

Bryan Ortiz: 2022 is a big year for Southwest Research Institute, as we celebrate our 75th anniversary. In July, we marked this important year with a conversation about SwRI founder, Tom Slick. As an oil heir, businessman, philanthropist, adventurer, author, and inventor, he impacted the world with his grand ideas and scientific pursuits. His son, Chuck Slick, and niece, Catherine Nixon Cooke, shared their stories and memories of the legendary founder of the Institute.

Chuck Slick: I would just say that, as I said before, is that he had these ideas that he thought he could, he thought that human life could be improved by proven science and engineering. And if he created a structure for the scientists and engineers to flourish in, that would be a great boon to humanity. And I would have to say, I think he was right in that case, given all the success that Texas Biomed and SwRI have had, especially.

Catherine Nixon Cooke: There's a direct quote from a letter that he wrote in 1952 that really backs up what Chuck is saying, and the quote is, "I would like to tell you how important the machinery of science is towards the future advancement of our civilization. Science gives us a tool of unparalleled effectiveness, by which we can improve our lives. And since science recognizes no geographic boundaries, the lives of people all over the world." I love that global vision that he had for science.

Lisa Peña: The CubeSat to study solar particles or CuSP mission lifted off as a secondary payload aboard NASA's Space Launch System last month on November 16th. SwRI's space scientist, Dr. Mihir Desai, principal investigator of CuSP, spoke to us back in August about the mission's goals to assess space weather, and learn more about space conditions that can disrupt technology and air travel on Earth. What does this type of data from solar particles reveal? What is it telling you about how we can protect ourselves from the adverse effects of solar weather?

Dr. Mihir Desai: Right, so the main questions that we want to answer is if a solar flare occurs near the sun, and it's associated with a coronal mass ejection, will we get affected at Earth in an hour or two hours, or three days later over a period of time? And right now, we have no means of telling whether a solar flare, even though it may be the most powerful solar flare you have seen, will impact Earth in any sense. So what we want to do is to we want to measure these particles to tell us, to give us critical information about in three areas. First of all, what is the material that is actually accelerated in these solar particles, the large events. Second is how exactly is this material selected and accelerated to higher energy, so the mechanisms of how the particles are accelerated. And finally, how does this particle, this accelerated material get to Earth, and then finally impact us.

Bryan Ortiz: SwRI engineers, Dr. Bapi Raju Surampudi, and Ian Smith joined us in September to talk about battery testing capabilities at SwRI. They are taking batteries to their limits with crushing, destructive, explosive testing to make sure they are safe. While most of the batteries tested at SwRI are for automotive use, they also test batteries for aircraft, space technology, and other important uses.

Dr. Bapi Surampudi: We, for example, test batteries that go in medical devices. Not implantable ones, but even devices that help consumers meet certain health guidelines. So in those applications, you can imagine how important it is for the battery to be reliable, delivering the power that's promised, and living for the duration of the product's shelf life.

Ian Smith: So some of the things that we're testing for are what happens with improper use of a battery. So what would happen if a battery cell, a module, or a pack gets overcharged because the correct safety devices weren't in place? What happens if there's a short circuit? Does the fuse open, or contactors open? What happens in a severe accident where there's a very large mechanical force that's exerted upon the battery?

Lisa Peña: In October, guest, Jerry Towler, engineer and assistant director of Robotics in SwRI's Intelligent Systems Division discussed technology for automated buses. He also told us about the new automated 14-passenger shuttle cruising around the SwRI campus. It is a Ford Transit, outfitted for autonomous driving. And fun for me, I got to take a ride. So it is hands-off driving. You just see the wheel moving by itself. It accelerates and breaks on its own. A really cool, firsthand experience for me, so thanks for setting that up. But what is the overall purpose of having a shuttle like this on our campus? How is it being used?

Jerry Towler: Well, I think there are really two uses for this shuttle. The first one is that our team has done a really great job of integrating a lot of our state of the art capabilities onto this one vehicle. So that's everything from motion execution through perception and machine learning, artificial intelligence, and connected vehicle technology all onto the same platform, so that we can not only test each of them individually, but also all of them together. So having that kind of demonstration and test platform is really important. However, it's also intended to actually give tours of campus. So we have people who want to visit all of our different facilities. And this is a way for them to get around, and take that automated windshield tour.

Bryan Ortiz: Just last month, we highlighted SwRI's award-winning technology, the intricately geared, supercritical carbon dioxide compactor, which was named one of the top 100 innovations of 2022 by R&D world magazine. SwRI engineers, Dr. Tim Allison, director of our machinery department, and Dr. Jason Wilks, manager in our machinery department, discuss the technology and supercritical carbon dioxide.

Dr. Tim Allison We do think that sCO₂ revolutionizes power generation for many different technologies. So as we feed renewables into the grid, concentrating solar power plants using sCO₂ might be a part of that mix. sCO₂ when we're doing carbon capture, or even sCO₂ from other sources, like nuclear can make very large power plants at the thousands of megawatt scale, which is enough to, which is comparable to today's largest power plants. And so that could all go into the energy mix that powers our homes. So I think the contender is revolutionary. And that it's one of the first few implementations of a type of technology. It showed a very successful test I would also point out that our sun shot expander that was developed by Dr. Jeffrey Moore about six years ago, it was the expansion part of this. And it aims at a different technology area, but both are very, very stringent in their requirements. So it's, I mean, in an entirely geared frame, it's about the highest temperature and pressure combination that's ever been tested. It's about the highest pressure dry gas you'll ever utilize.

LP: Amazing, Bryan, I have enjoyed having a co-host today.

BO: Thank you. It was fantastic and it was fun to do this side of the job for a while. Very cool. Thank you for that opportunity.

LP: I hope we don't have to reverse though. I'm not sure that I could do the technical stuff. So hopefully, it's not one for one. But so that was 2022. What a year, and really, so many great moments to listen and learn. And now, 50 whole episodes. So Bryan, now with 50 episodes under your belt, what do you like most about being involved with the podcast?

BO: I know it might sound silly, aside from all the great technology that we get to talk about and hear, all the wonderful guests that we've had on the show, I think what I like most is the feeling of accomplishment that we have achieved 50 episodes. And what I mean by that is sometimes in your work, you don't get to do something so consistent for so long. And that's really nice because it can be very difficult when you're doing creative work to be able to be consistent, and push out a lot of product. So the fact that we've actually been able to do 50 episodes, and hopefully, 50 more to go is a very wonderful, accomplishing feeling, and I love that aspect about doing the show.

LP: And I love that answer because you're absolutely right. It has been awesome to be able to do this every month, to connect with our guests and get this information out to our listeners, and it's really been an amazing experience for me as well. So I completely agree with you on that. I'm looking forward to the next 50 and beyond.

BO: Before we go, I do have one more question for you. Our SwRI mission is to advance science and technology to benefit government, industry, and all of humanity. And we often ask our guests how their work contributes to the mission. So I think that this is a good time to turn that question around. How does this podcast contribute to the mission?

LP: Gosh, that is a tough question. It feels a little different receiving that question, rather than asking it. But I really feel like the podcast does contribute to our SwRI mission of advancing science and technology to benefit all of humanity because I feel like there really is value in sharing knowledge. And I feel like that's what our scientists and engineers do with every episode. They give us a glimpse into their world. They help us understand this technology that we use every day. I feel like it creates a connection, so the technology and the creation of technology isn't a far off concept. So along with fostering an understanding and appreciation of engineering, science, and technology, I really hope that some listeners out there are also inspired to think outside of the box, to solve problems. It's what so many of our guests do on a daily basis in their work. They're really pushing boundaries, and really reaching for the creative aspects of technology, science, and engineering. And bringing us great solutions, and great products that make our lives easier. So yeah, I hope there's a spark of inspiration out there for our listeners, and I think that's really the value of this podcast, is sharing the knowledge and hopefully, some of that inspiration.

BO: Well said. Well said.

LP: Well again, Bryan, so that's it. That's a wrap on episode 50. Can you believe it?

BO: Yes! 50 and 50 more to go.

LP: That's right. So thank you again for joining us as our co-host today. This was really so much fun.

BO: It was. Thank you again for having me. I'm very, very grateful.

And thank you to all of our guests this past year, and over 50 episodes. And thank you to our listeners for learning along with us throughout 2022. We wish you a happy and healthy new year. You can hear all of our Technology Today episodes, and see photos, and complete transcripts at podcast.swri.org. Remember to share our podcast and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform.

Want to see what else we're up to? Connect with Southwest Research Institute on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn, and YouTube. Check out the Technology Today Magazine at technologytoday.swri.org. And now is a great time to become an SwRI problem solver. Visit our career page at SwRI.jobs.

Ian McKinney and Bryan Ortiz are the podcast audio engineers and editors. And sometimes, co-host. I am producer and host, Lisa Peña.

Thanks for listening.

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